Atlas City Project

I think that any sort of transportation technology that is had in mind, must be not only clean renewable energy but also community minded. So my feeling that private vehicles should not be allowed in Atlas City. There can be one or two cars available to everyone for traveling outside the city occasionally but no more than that. I think that with transportation - as with everything in Atlas City - everything must be built with a spirit of community, and geared away from individualism. I think this imperative, crucial, vital, key, integral, central, essential, etc.

Even we HAVE THE ABILITY to create cleanburning private vehicles - It is wrong. This is the attitude that breeds greed and reckless innovation. I think this attitude is crucial to be kept in mind while building Atlas City so that the builders don't fall into the same trap as humanity has fallen in before time and time again. We must curb our creativity and always direct it in the direction that best fosters community and unity, rather than individualism and separation. Look at America, drives the most privatecars, and is the most environmentally destructive. Europe is not quite like us, they have a much better attitude toward public transport. That's why it takes 5 Earths if everyone lived like Americans, and only 3 if Everyone lived like Europeans. (google it), yes I know that's not saying much - because we don't have 3 Earths as it is - but they're in a much better position that USA.

Well in Atlas you cannot "curb" anything. Everyone must be allowed to do as they please. Of course transition is a little different but in the end result no one should ever be told they can't have something, as long as it doesn't hurt anyone they should be allowed to have it within reasonable means.

Personal vehicles today are destructive and dangerous. We can out think this primitive means of transportation. We can create many vehicles that travel through air, use no fuel, are not physically controlled by the operator and only show up to their house when needed. Kind of like a taxi service that is totally operated by computers. A person tells their home computer "I need to get from point A to point B" and the computer tells the other computer over at the vehicle storage area to send the appropriate type of vehicle needed for such endeavor. The vehicle arrives and user and others climb in and they are delivered to their destination.

We don't want to go backwards in technology as in "everyone has to ride a bus." We want to apply creative technology and properly manage it. Money is hindering our forward progression as a species. Once it is gone we will be able to create this advanced technology that has been hidden from us quickly and easily.

Community will be found not by forcing everyone to ride a bus but by fostering the creativity and participation in community functions.

Yes the key is not to condition anything, only improve by being the problem solver. It's a matter of attaining this AND that, not this OR that. Improvement of technology as a tool, not the diminishment of it.

I just had a thought. We really don't want any cars in the city. The plan is that within the city people will get around by walking, biking, electric (go-cart like) vehicles, and possibly a monorail. When leaving the city they can get an electric/sustainable vehicle from transportation services and go spend some time in Vegas or Cali or where ever is close.

However, we will need a parking garage on the outskirts of town for visitors. This will greatly depend on how large the hotel is and how often/many residents can have visit them at one time. Any thoughts on this subject so far? I don't think we can tell them to park on the outside of town since we have no jurisdiction to provide security.

maybe for a short period of time during transition we will have a few cars for transportation outside the city but we should focus on creating a better answer to that problem. Telling someone they cant have a means of transportation is limiting and limitations are exactly what we are trying to get rid of.

Jinx wrote:


Wow, after reading this post I just realized how much I disagree with what you guys are trying to do here.
I have a few fundamental convictions that this planning project is completely going against. One of them is that I am extremely leery of making people so dependent on technology. I do believe in the spiritual advancement of humanity, however allowing technology to take over personal effort, I believe will not get us there. It's like taking spoiled little children and spoiling them even more and expecting it to fix the problem. Evolving our minds and bodies to this kind of a lifestyle just doesn't seem natural. The human body was meant for physical work and personal effort, for self-involvement and community involvement in the achievement of your basic needs - and through this the character develops naturally. This is what leads to self-esteem. When you remove people from that natural state, that leaves them really helpless and disconnected from reality. Today we live our lives by proxy, passively allowing corporations to fulfill our lives... but if we say goodbye to the corporation and introduce more technology, our lives will still be lived by proxy. There is nothing like doing things for yourself, in a small community. I can tell you this from personal experience, between living on a farm in a village and living as a nameless in a city of 300,000. Allow nature to be your guide. What we need to save the world is LOVE, not more technology.

So I think I'm going to respectfully step down from this forum, because I'm only going to get in your way.

Good luck to all of you!

Then you obviously don't understand this movement AT ALL. Think of futuristic movies, psy-fi movies (I know you enjoy these due to your obsession with Avatar.

Try to imagine the automation of Star Wars, the society of StarGate SG1's Tolen population (if you don't watch StarGate I highly recommend seeing episodes with this culture just to prove some basic points).

Through out technology we will be able to improve ourselves exponentially more then we can currently. Instead of spending 30-60 hours a week with work, then be too stressed and tired when we get home that a majority of people just want to have a few drinks and go to sleep, we will have this time for personal achievement and contemplation. It's not spoiling children to give them greater technology. It's spoiling them by not having any sway over their lives. It's like giving them a loaded gun and not explaining the safety tips. This is just a slight insight into what will happen, but for further explanation this will have to be moved to the philosophies forum. I don't want to load this thread up with ideological differences.

Neytiri wrote:


Ah, crap. While I agree with what you say about tooooo much dependence on technology, one of the premises of the The Venus Project IS in fact technology, and it being the key to freedom - freeing people to live and do as they please so as not to hinder us from letting our creativity go wild! But then you swing too far, and go all hippy on us with the nature garbage. Hey, that's fine, but I still want to shave and use deodorant. TEchnology should not take over, but a balance must be struck and we can do so. We need to identify those areas in which technology would be beneficial and those areas where it is either not needed/wanted, or otherwise burdensome.

Personal vehicles may be somewhat destructive and dangerous today, but are becoming much less so, and the technology is improving constantly to eliminate risk, someday perhaps near 100%. Technology is the only way to do this, clearly!! Why stifle this??

Atlas City may or may not choose to eliminate cars - but a SERIOUS examination into why or why not must be undertaken, not some hippy, mother-earth based, emotionally driven, green agenda way of thinking response like CARS BAD. A critical evaluation is necessary - arguments for all sides must be put onto the table.

We will get a lot of this. The key is to automate jobs more then make everyone dependent on technology. For those that want it they should be able to have the best of all technology available. The city will also have very Earth-based concepts as well, however, so it's not a one or the other argument. If you want to refrain from all technology personally it will be completely possible.

Indeed! It must be optional - use as much a or as little as one wants.

We've discussed electric vehicles in the city, as well as conversions for outsiders and their old gas guzzlers. This company is one of the leading electric battery producers for larger vehicles.

www.a123systems.com/

> I'm only going to get in your way.

I think it is important for people to get in the way, else we end up with a single minded view, and we could easily make errors in our thinking.


Whilst I'm in theory for public transport, having experienced it for many years I can tell you that the practical side of it is far from perfect and is why so many people prefer their own private transport.

If we are to wean people away from cars, we would need to improve public transport a lot in my view.

Creating a city with a lack of facalities for cars I think is the wrong way to go, as I reckon good public transport will take a while to develop and fix the inheriant problems within it, if they can indeed be fixed..

A half way house that may please many people is a taxi service, as that can easily be staffed by human drivers without requiring any real technlology.


My current plan for low cost affordable transport for a community is pedal powered velomobiles with electrical assistance, this would also allow a taxi option, and fitted with solar panels could run independant of any electricity grid requirements.

This would address some of the concerns I reckon of people being too disconnected from nature by offering the option of physical exertion.

But still allow the use of eco-friendly 4x4 for those with the need for them, large families, shopping, moving of large items.

Things I would consider important in a city would be keeping the number of toxic emission vehicles down to a low number, eg. electric vehicles over gas guzzlers, unless for say emergency vehicles/etc.